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MIT Scientists Created a New Method of Turning CO2 into Fuel

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  • Steve Kurtz
    EROEI? Done using solar or waste heat according to this, but extremely high temperatures are required. Steve ... ————————————— Doubt
    Message 1 of 7 , 28 Nov, 2017
      EROEI?  Done using solar or waste heat according to this, but extremely high temperatures are required.

      Steve



      —————————————
      Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd.
      Voltaire (1770)

    • Luis Gutierrez
      I have the same question: EROEI? Sounds too good to be true. Also, scale up? Luis On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 7:56 PM, Steve Kurtz kurtzs@ncf.ca [gaiapc]
      Message 2 of 7 , 28 Nov, 2017
        I have the same question: EROEI?  Sounds too good to be true.  Also, scale up?

        Luis

        On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 7:56 PM, Steve Kurtz kurtzs@... [gaiapc] <gaiapc@...> wrote:
         

        EROEI?  Done using solar or waste heat according to this, but extremely high temperatures are required.

        Steve



        —————————————
        Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd.
        Voltaire (1770)


      • Jada Thacker
        Exactly. Things too good to be true are not true. We can change lead into gold, too, but we can t do so without massive external energy inputs more valuable
        Message 3 of 7 , 28 Nov, 2017
          Exactly. Things too good to be true are not true. We can change lead into gold, too, but we can't do so without massive external energy inputs more valuable than gold. Same here with energy. That's why these sorts of articles never mention EROEI. To be fair, the scientists probably are not scamming. If you asked them personally, they'd most likely readily admit their process uses far more energy than it "produces." That's why the journalists never ask such questions: doing so does not sell advertising or snag investors -- which is the sole purpose of such "informative" articles.

          Jada


          On Tuesday, November 28, 2017 7:07 PM, "Luis Gutierrez ltg4263@... [gaiapc]" <gaiapc@...> wrote:


           
          I have the same question: EROEI?  Sounds too good to be true.  Also, scale up?

          Luis

          On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 7:56 PM, Steve Kurtz kurtzs@... [gaiapc] <gaiapc@...> wrote:
           
          EROEI?  Done using solar or waste heat according to this, but extremely high temperatures are required.

          Steve



          —————————————
          Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd.
          Voltaire (1770)




        • Richard Balfour
          See the French and Spanish fields of arrays that focus the sun on a tower collector, the temperatures can be staggering, creating instant steam, and if scaled
          Message 4 of 7 , 29 Nov, 2017
            See the French and Spanish fields of arrays that focus the sun on a tower collector, the temperatures can be staggering, creating instant steam, and if scaled up with enough heat that nothing can withstand it.   Apparently the ancients did this too and then weaponized it.

            On 2017-11-28, at 4:56 PM, Steve Kurtz kurtzs@... [gaiapc] wrote:

             

            EROEI?  Done using solar or waste heat according to this, but extremely high temperatures are required.

            Steve



            —————————————
            Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd.
            Voltaire (1770)



            Richard Balfour  
            Strategic Planner
            • SPORPORI Strategic Planning for Ocean Rise and Peak Oil Resettlement Institute

            7276 Denman Road Denman Island BC Canada V0R 1T0             250 335 0766
            Balfour Strategic Planning
            www.plancanada.com

            • Vancouver Peak Oil Executive www.vancouverpeakoil.org

            balfourarch@...











          • Jada Thacker
            Apparently the ancients did this too and then weaponized it. Can you elaborate on this? I agree that the solar-salt heat arrays are impressive, though I
            Message 5 of 7 , 29 Nov, 2017
              "Apparently the ancients did this too and then weaponized it."
              Can you elaborate on this? 
              I agree that the solar-salt heat arrays are impressive, though I don't know what the EROEI may be. As usual, scalability is always a problem, not to mention that only limited geographical regions have cloudless, high-intensity solar radiation year round -- which introduces transmission-loss problems. So there are a lot of issues. 
              Jada



              On Wednesday, November 29, 2017 1:56 PM, "Richard Balfour balfourarch@... [gaiapc]" <gaiapc@...> wrote:


               
              See the French and Spanish fields of arrays that focus the sun on a tower collector, the temperatures can be staggering, creating instant steam, and if scaled up with enough heat that nothing can withstand it.   Apparently the ancients did this too and then weaponized it.

              On 2017-11-28, at 4:56 PM, Steve Kurtz kurtzs@... [gaiapc] wrote:

               

              EROEI?  Done using solar or waste heat according to this, but extremely high temperatures are required.

              Steve



              —————————————
              Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd.
              Voltaire (1770)



              Richard Balfour  
              Strategic Planner
              • SPORPORI Strategic Planning for Ocean Rise and Peak Oil Resettlement Institute

              7276 Denman Road Denman Island BC Canada V0R 1T0             250 335 0766
              Balfour Strategic Planning
              www.plancanada.com

              • Vancouver Peak Oil Executive www.vancouverpeakoil.org

              balfourarch@...














              Virus-free. www.avg.com
            • Richard Balfour
              I cannot remember the specific references, but from a number of them. Greeks and others before them, ref Salon via Plato.... polished man sized copper mirrors
              Message 6 of 7 , 30 Nov, 2017
                I cannot remember the specific references, but from a number of them. Greeks and others before them, ref Salon  via Plato.... polished man sized copper mirrors and shields to focus sunlight onto an enemy force or ship, to stun burn, start fires...

                r
                On 2017-11-29, at 7:27 PM, Jada Thacker jadathacker@... [gaiapc] wrote:

                 

                "Apparently the ancients did this too and then weaponized it."
                Can you elaborate on this? 
                I agree that the solar-salt heat arrays are impressive, though I don't know what the EROEI may be. As usual, scalability is always a problem, not to mention that only limited geographical regions have cloudless, high-intensity solar radiation year round -- which introduces transmission-loss problems. So there are a lot of issues. 
                Jada



                On Wednesday, November 29, 2017 1:56 PM, "Richard Balfour balfourarch@... [gaiapc]" <gaiapc@...> wrote:


                 
                See the French and Spanish fields of arrays that focus the sun on a tower collector, the temperatures can be staggering, creating instant steam, and if scaled up with enough heat that nothing can withstand it.   Apparently the ancients did this too and then weaponized it.

                On 2017-11-28, at 4:56 PM, Steve Kurtz kurtzs@... [gaiapc] wrote:

                 

                EROEI?  Done using solar or waste heat according to this, but extremely high temperatures are required.

                Steve



                —————————————
                Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd.
                Voltaire (1770)



                Richard Balfour  
                Strategic Planner
                • SPORPORI Strategic Planning for Ocean Rise and Peak Oil Resettlement Institute

                7276 Denman Road Denman Island BC Canada V0R 1T0             250 335 0766
                Balfour Strategic Planning
                www.plancanada.com

                • Vancouver Peak Oil Executive www.vancouverpeakoil.org

                balfourarch@...














                Virus-free. www.avg.com


                Richard Balfour  
                Strategic Planner
                • SPORPORI Strategic Planning for Ocean Rise and Peak Oil Resettlement Institute

                7276 Denman Road Denman Island BC Canada V0R 1T0             250 335 0766
                Balfour Strategic Planning
                www.plancanada.com

                • Vancouver Peak Oil Executive www.vancouverpeakoil.org

                balfourarch@...











              • Jada Thacker
                Thanks. I had not heard of it. Jada On Thursday, November 30, 2017 6:01 PM, Richard Balfour balfourarch@telus.net [gaiapc] wrote:  
                Message 7 of 7 , 30 Nov, 2017
                  Thanks. I had not heard of it.

                  Jada


                  On Thursday, November 30, 2017 6:01 PM, "Richard Balfour balfourarch@... [gaiapc]" <gaiapc@...> wrote:


                   
                  I cannot remember the specific references, but from a number of them. Greeks and others before them, ref Salon  via Plato.... polished man sized copper mirrors and shields to focus sunlight onto an enemy force or ship, to stun burn, start fires...

                  r
                  On 2017-11-29, at 7:27 PM, Jada Thacker jadathacker@... [gaiapc] wrote:

                   

                  "Apparently the ancients did this too and then weaponized it."
                  Can you elaborate on this? 
                  I agree that the solar-salt heat arrays are impressive, though I don't know what the EROEI may be. As usual, scalability is always a problem, not to mention that only limited geographical regions have cloudless, high-intensity solar radiation year round -- which introduces transmission-loss problems. So there are a lot of issues. 
                  Jada



                  On Wednesday, November 29, 2017 1:56 PM, "Richard Balfour balfourarch@... [gaiapc]" <gaiapc@...> wrote:


                   
                  See the French and Spanish fields of arrays that focus the sun on a tower collector, the temperatures can be staggering, creating instant steam, and if scaled up with enough heat that nothing can withstand it.   Apparently the ancients did this too and then weaponized it.

                  On 2017-11-28, at 4:56 PM, Steve Kurtz kurtzs@... [gaiapc] wrote:

                   

                  EROEI?  Done using solar or waste heat according to this, but extremely high temperatures are required.

                  Steve



                  —————————————
                  Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd.
                  Voltaire (1770)



                  Richard Balfour  
                  Strategic Planner
                  • SPORPORI Strategic Planning for Ocean Rise and Peak Oil Resettlement Institute

                  7276 Denman Road Denman Island BC Canada V0R 1T0             250 335 0766
                  Balfour Strategic Planning
                  www.plancanada.com

                  • Vancouver Peak Oil Executive www.vancouverpeakoil.org

                  balfourarch@...














                  altVirus-free. www.avg.com


                  Richard Balfour  
                  Strategic Planner
                  • SPORPORI Strategic Planning for Ocean Rise and Peak Oil Resettlement Institute

                  7276 Denman Road Denman Island BC Canada V0R 1T0             250 335 0766
                  Balfour Strategic Planning
                  www.plancanada.com

                  • Vancouver Peak Oil Executive www.vancouverpeakoil.org

                  balfourarch@...













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