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Quantum physics and the question of consciousness:

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  • Sean Ryan
      Hello, two scientists Ihave found interesting and followed for about a decade now are “Stuart Hammeroff and Sir RodgerPenrose” one is anesthesiologist
    Message 1 of 5 , 26 Dec, 2017
       
      Hello, two scientists I have found interesting and followed for about a decade now are “Stuart Hammeroff and Sir Rodger Penrose” one is anesthesiologist the other a mathematician. In a simple search like this one you could find them and explore their ideas on YouTube.
       
       

      Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff

      Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff on controversial theory of consciousn...
       
      Their hypothesis is kind of built around the question of: Does consciousness exist just in our own minds or does it exist in the larger universe and we tap into it somehow?  It has to do with quantum physics and something they call microtubules (found both in photosynthesis and in our brains).  It’s been critically examined for about 15 years now… but not able to be proven wrong yet.
       
      Thus, if someday proven true what it means is that consciousness is something part of the universe and we tap into it and thus it would mean humans would have some kind of soul. 
       
      In terms of the Gaia Hypothesis and our intense natural resource problems I have always thought that if people realized they did have a soul they would be much more likely to act responsibly. 
       
      Not and expert, but two interesting scientists with a potentially useful hypothesis, look into their ideas and you tell me it their hypothesis has any validity. 
       
      Can’t wait to see if heir hypothesis is eventually proven true or false; it would have significant implications, philosophically and otherwise.    
       
      For instance I have often wondered if ‘Gaia’ “thinks” somehow.  If life really is a planetary phenomenon she would likely have to think somehow, even if it was not in a way we could easy relate too as human creatures.  Kind regards.
       
      Sean Ryan LLA, ASLA
      Landscape architect
    • Stanley N Salthe
      This shows how fertile QM imagination has become. Why NOT?! Let it rip; lots a fun. STAN On Tue, Dec 26, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Sean Ryan beta.regio@yahoo.com
      Message 2 of 5 , 26 Dec, 2017
        This shows how fertile QM imagination has become.  Why NOT?!  Let it rip; lots'a fun.

        STAN

        On Tue, Dec 26, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Sean Ryan beta.regio@... [gaiapc] <gaiapc@...> wrote:
         

         
        Hello, two scientists I have found interesting and followed for about a decade now are “Stuart Hammeroff and Sir Rodger Penrose” one is anesthesiologist the other a mathematician. In a simple search like this one you could find them and explore their ideas on YouTube.
         
         

        Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff

        Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff on controversial theory of consciousn...
         
        Their hypothesis is kind of built around the question of: Does consciousness exist just in our own minds or does it exist in the larger universe and we tap into it somehow?  It has to do with quantum physics and something they call microtubules (found both in photosynthesis and in our brains).  It’s been critically examined for about 15 years now… but not able to be proven wrong yet.
         
        Thus, if someday proven true what it means is that consciousness is something part of the universe and we tap into it and thus it would mean humans would have some kind of soul. 
         
        In terms of the Gaia Hypothesis and our intense natural resource problems I have always thought that if people realized they did have a soul they would be much more likely to act responsibly. 
         
        Not and expert, but two interesting scientists with a potentially useful hypothesis, look into their ideas and you tell me it their hypothesis has any validity. 
         
        Can’t wait to see if heir hypothesis is eventually proven true or false; it would have significant implications, philosophically and otherwise.    
         
        For instance I have often wondered if ‘Gaia’ “thinks” somehow.  If life really is a planetary phenomenon she would likely have to think somehow, even if it was not in a way we could easy relate too as human creatures.  Kind regards.
         
        Sean Ryan LLA, ASLA
        Landscape architect


      • Sean Ryan
        If they are wrong, prove it!   Use the scientific process... stop wasting time... 100 species going extinct per day... the worst mass extinction in 60+
        Message 3 of 5 , 26 Dec, 2017
          If they are wrong, prove it!  

          Use the scientific process... stop wasting time... 100 species going extinct per day... the worst mass extinction in 60+ million years.  Thus there is some urgency to find the answer to some big questions: Yes the idea of "God" in human society... consciousness, human reality, etc. (big questions), no matter how uncomfortable it may make one person's world view (and self identity) feel.  

          The 'Gaia Hypothesis' is certainly a weird and statically socially unpopular idea, but if you are a true scientist and grapple with the facts... unfortunately seems pretty true.  Watch Carl Sagan's "Pale Blue Dot" video and you tell me.  

          Please lets go for answers based upon the scientific process, facts and the results... if we personally like them or not.  

          If these guys don't make sense please lay out the facts (like you and the GPC scientists they seem pretty well grounded) in scientific reality... have you studied their hypothesis? 

          Lay out some scientific facts against these two scientists.  But reality is the whole name of this list "Gaia" is based upon Jame Lovelock and he was highly criticized, but his Earth Science view of the world was apparently right, if socially popular or not.  
          Sorry, not trying to cause trouble, but Planet Earth is under great stress, we have to put our own ego's and point of view second and tray and find reality as a first priority.  

          Hameroff and Penrose seem like they have a solid argument... again if wrong lay out some facts.  

          If their hypothesis is true... it would have great implications for what the goals of the GPC are.  

          Please lets find and answer. 

          - Sean  



          From: "Stanley N Salthe ssalthe@... [gaiapc]" <gaiapc@...>
          To: Members of GaiaPC <gaiapc@...>
          Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2017 2:48 PM
          Subject: Re: [gaiapc] Quantum physics and the question of consciousness:

           
          This shows how fertile QM imagination has become.  Why NOT?!  Let it rip; lots'a fun.

          STAN

          On Tue, Dec 26, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Sean Ryan beta.regio@... [gaiapc] <gaiapc@...> wrote:
           
           
          Hello, two scientists I have found interesting and followed for about a decade now are “Stuart Hammeroff and Sir Rodger Penrose” one is anesthesiologist the other a mathematician. In a simple search like this one you could find them and explore their ideas on YouTube.
           
           

          Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff

          Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff on controversial theory of consciousn...
           
          Their hypothesis is kind of built around the question of: Does consciousness exist just in our own minds or does it exist in the larger universe and we tap into it somehow?  It has to do with quantum physics and something they call microtubules (found both in photosynthesis and in our brains).  It’s been critically examined for about 15 years now… but not able to be proven wrong yet.
           
          Thus, if someday proven true what it means is that consciousness is something part of the universe and we tap into it and thus it would mean humans would have some kind of soul. 
           
          In terms of the Gaia Hypothesis and our intense natural resource problems I have always thought that if people realized they did have a soul they would be much more likely to act responsibly. 
           
          Not and expert, but two interesting scientists with a potentially useful hypothesis, look into their ideas and you tell me it their hypothesis has any validity. 
           
          Can’t wait to see if heir hypothesis is eventually proven true or false; it would have significant implications, philosophically and otherwise.    
           
          For instance I have often wondered if ‘Gaia’ “thinks” somehow.  If life really is a planetary phenomenon she would likely have to think somehow, even if it was not in a way we could easy relate too as human creatures.  Kind regards.
           
          Sean Ryan LLA, ASLA
          Landscape architect



        • Steve Kurtz
          Sean, Microtubules are physical phenomena. So are quantum particles/waves. Energy, it seems to me, must be expended in movement. Have a look at this short
          Message 4 of 5 , 26 Dec, 2017
            Sean,

            Microtubules are physical phenomena. So are quantum particles/waves. Energy, it seems to me, must be expended in movement. Have a look at this short piece which is another speculative position on consciousness.


            Steve

            On Dec 26, 2017, at 11:45 AM, Sean Ryan beta.regio@... [gaiapc] <gaiapc@...> wrote:


             
            Hello, two scientists I have found interesting and followed for about a decade now are “Stuart Hammeroff and Sir Rodger Penrose” one is anesthesiologist the other a mathematician. In a simple search like this one you could find them and explore their ideas on YouTube.
             
             

            Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff

            Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff on controversial theory of consciousn...
             
            Their hypothesis is kind of built around the question of: Does consciousness exist just in our own minds or does it exist in the larger universe and we tap into it somehow?  It has to do with quantum physics and something they call microtubules (found both in photosynthesis and in our brains).  It’s been critically examined for about 15 years now… but not able to be proven wrong yet.
             
            Thus, if someday proven true what it means is that consciousness is something part of the universe and we tap into it and thus it would mean humans would have some kind of soul. 
             
            In terms of the Gaia Hypothesis and our intense natural resource problems I have always thought that if people realized they did have a soul they would be much more likely to act responsibly. 
             
            Not and expert, but two interesting scientists with a potentially useful hypothesis, look into their ideas and you tell me it their hypothesis has any validity. 
             
            Can’t wait to see if heir hypothesis is eventually proven true or false; it would have significant implications, philosophically and otherwise.    
             
            For instance I have often wondered if ‘Gaia’ “thinks” somehow.  If life really is a planetary phenomenon she would likely have to think somehow, even if it was not in a way we could easy relate too as human creatures.  Kind regards.
             
            Sean Ryan LLA, ASLA
            Landscape architect


            —————————————
            Doubt is not a pleasant condition, but certainty is absurd.
            Voltaire (1770)

          • Stanley N Salthe
            Sean -- It may, I think, not be a case of they re being wrong , but rather a matter of being playful with the only toys that seem to be on the table. STAN
            Message 5 of 5 , 27 Dec, 2017
              Sean -- It may, I think, not be a case of 'they're being wrong', but rather a matter of being 'playful' with the only toys that seem to be on the table.

              STAN

              On Tue, Dec 26, 2017 at 4:12 PM, Sean Ryan beta.regio@... [gaiapc] <gaiapc@...> wrote:
               

              If they are wrong, prove it!  

              Use the scientific process... stop wasting time... 100 species going extinct per day... the worst mass extinction in 60+ million years.  Thus there is some urgency to find the answer to some big questions: Yes the idea of "God" in human society... consciousness, human reality, etc. (big questions), no matter how uncomfortable it may make one person's world view (and self identity) feel.  

              The 'Gaia Hypothesis' is certainly a weird and statically socially unpopular idea, but if you are a true scientist and grapple with the facts... unfortunately seems pretty true.  Watch Carl Sagan's "Pale Blue Dot" video and you tell me.  

              Please lets go for answers based upon the scientific process, facts and the results... if we personally like them or not.  

              If these guys don't make sense please lay out the facts (like you and the GPC scientists they seem pretty well grounded) in scientific reality... have you studied their hypothesis? 

              Lay out some scientific facts against these two scientists.  But reality is the whole name of this list "Gaia" is based upon Jame Lovelock and he was highly criticized, but his Earth Science view of the world was apparently right, if socially popular or not.  
              Sorry, not trying to cause trouble, but Planet Earth is under great stress, we have to put our own ego's and point of view second and tray and find reality as a first priority.  

              Hameroff and Penrose seem like they have a solid argument... again if wrong lay out some facts.  

              If their hypothesis is true... it would have great implications for what the goals of the GPC are.  

              Please lets find and answer. 

              - Sean  



              From: "Stanley N Salthe ssalthe@... [gaiapc]" <gaiapc@...>
              To: Members of GaiaPC <gaiapc@...>
              Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2017 2:48 PM
              Subject: Re: [gaiapc] Quantum physics and the question of consciousness:

               
              This shows how fertile QM imagination has become.  Why NOT?!  Let it rip; lots'a fun.

              STAN

              On Tue, Dec 26, 2017 at 11:45 AM, Sean Ryan beta.regio@... [gaiapc] <gaiapc@...> wrote:
               
               
              Hello, two scientists I have found interesting and followed for about a decade now are “Stuart Hammeroff and Sir Rodger Penrose” one is anesthesiologist the other a mathematician. In a simple search like this one you could find them and explore their ideas on YouTube.
               
               

              Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff

              Interview with Nobel prize candidate Sir Roger Penrose and Stuart Hameroff on controversial theory of consciousn...
               
              Their hypothesis is kind of built around the question of: Does consciousness exist just in our own minds or does it exist in the larger universe and we tap into it somehow?  It has to do with quantum physics and something they call microtubules (found both in photosynthesis and in our brains).  It’s been critically examined for about 15 years now… but not able to be proven wrong yet.
               
              Thus, if someday proven true what it means is that consciousness is something part of the universe and we tap into it and thus it would mean humans would have some kind of soul. 
               
              In terms of the Gaia Hypothesis and our intense natural resource problems I have always thought that if people realized they did have a soul they would be much more likely to act responsibly. 
               
              Not and expert, but two interesting scientists with a potentially useful hypothesis, look into their ideas and you tell me it their hypothesis has any validity. 
               
              Can’t wait to see if heir hypothesis is eventually proven true or false; it would have significant implications, philosophically and otherwise.    
               
              For instance I have often wondered if ‘Gaia’ “thinks” somehow.  If life really is a planetary phenomenon she would likely have to think somehow, even if it was not in a way we could easy relate too as human creatures.  Kind regards.
               
              Sean Ryan LLA, ASLA
              Landscape architect




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